December 11, 2011

Show #170: Braves Leave Winter Meetings Empty Handed

JJ and Prado still on the block.  The short stop position. The fortified Marlins. And the Albert Pujols deal.

 

 

122 Responses to “Show #170: Braves Leave Winter Meetings Empty Handed”

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  1. 51
    DAP Says:

    By the way, I don’t believe that rumor about Wren offering Prado AND Jurrjens AND a prospect for Jones. Wren is not stupid enough to offer that, nor are the Orioles stupid enough to turn it down.

    Nate, Adam Jones is not better than Cody Ross by any objective measure, other than his youth. If you want to ignore the fact and decide Jones is better, do it. But objectively, at best you could say they are equal. I don’t say this to talk up Cody Ross, just trying to display a relatively equatable player. No one here would EVER trade Jair Jurrejns or Martin Prado for Cody Ross. But for some reason, a similar, possibly worse player is worth both those guys together…and a prospect? It just crazy.

  2. 52
    David Says:

    DAP — I agree with your point in #50. At this point, the Braves have $14.7 million obligated for 2013, according to Cot’s Baseball Contracts. That includes:

    Dan Uggla – $13.2 million
    along with a bunch of options, including McCann, Hudson, Chipper. If those options vest, here’s what we’ll have:
    McCann – $12 million
    Chipper – $7 million
    Hudson – $9 million
    …Which adds another $28 million, running the total up to around $45 million. If this is Chipper’s final year (no sure thing, I think), that takes it down to about $38 million in obligated funds. I think that this time next year, the Braves will be very involved in several of those big free agent negotiations, especially for outfielders.

    I think that a lot of the “Braves never go after free agents” talk is a bit short-sighted as well as unfocused. DAP — you’re right to point out the Derek Lowe and Kawakami signings. The fact that we’re not players for any of the big free agents this year — 1B (Pujols, Fielder), a SS that will command a long-term contract as well as big bucks (Rollins, Reyes), a starting pitcher (Buerhle, CJ Wilson), or OF (Willingham, Beltran) — is more a result of the Braves either having good, homegrown players at those positions (1B, SP, and Pastornicky/Simmons, who even if he’s not good now, they can’t commit longterm to one of those guys) OR having several big contracts (Chipper, Hudson) that would prohibit signing a big free agent.

    Oh yeah — and then there’s that Prado guy on our roster, the guy that plays several positions and should be back to normal health next year, the guy that, I think, Wren would be a fool to trade away while he’s still good and affordable.

    And would y’all really want the Braves to be a team that makes it a habit of signing free agents? Of paying top dollar for guys who may be at their peaks now, but a couple of years into their long-term contracts, begin to decline? I know it makes for an exciting offseason, but the GM’s job is to set up the team so that they’re celebrating in October, not December and January.

  3. 53
    Walker Says:

    Frank Wren really can’t be that dumb to offer a JJ and Prado and a prospect for Jones.

  4. 54
    Walker Says:

    The Braves swooped in on KK because nobody knew anything about him and they overpayed for Lowe who was well past his prime. My point is we could never afford a player who is a big time commodity in their prime years.

    The only big free agents in their prime the Braves have signed have been Brian Jordan, Galaragga and Maddux.

  5. 55
    Curt Says:

    If you guys think we will be in on the Josh Hamilton bidding next year, I have a bridge to sell you.

    I don’t think the Braves have to get in on signing or trying to sign any or all of the big free agents that come up season to season. That has never really been the approach around here. Most of what they do is through their own system and through trades. That being said, you can’t expect that every rookie that comes through your system is going to be McCann, Kimbrel or Heyward. There are going to be some misses. I just hope they address those needs in a proactive way instead of waiting two years for the next in-house candidate to come along.

    At this point, re-signing Bourn would be a big step to me.

    And to your point David, have we been doing any October celebrating that I missed? I get your point, but it isn’t like this team is reeling off championships with the team they have in place. When was the last time we even won a postseason series?

    Answer: 10 years ago.

  6. 56
    Steve Says:

    #51 – Agreed. That whole rumor is absurd. Got to be the Orioles trying to set expectations with the baseball GMs about how big a haul they want for Jones.

    Speaking of Wren, this is a good blog about him at Braves Wire: http://braveswire.com/frank-wren-the-best-in-the-business/

  7. 57
    DAP Says:

    curt, josh hamilton, probably not, unless his value unexpectedly drops. but, there really are alot of free agent outfielders available next offseason. i think we will sign at least one, maybe two of them.

  8. 58
    Walker Says:

    It’s really disheartening watching mlb network and hear Mitch Williams and Larry Bowa say sabermetrics are complete crap and shouldn’t be apart of the game. I tuned in for smart analysis and I hear this. I see why Bowa has been fired a few times and why Mitch Williams isn’t coaching. You can’t ignore facts.

  9. 59
    Nate Says:

    Does Mitch Williams still have a mullet and take steroids?

    I hate trade rumors. Can we fast forward to April?

    We got Bourn for nothing after hearing from Trade Rumors that we might have to give up 1 or 2 of the Four Horseman of the Pitchpocalypse to get a player of Bourn or Pence’s caliber.

    I’m convinced 95% of anything you read on a trade rumors is complete speculation.

    Who had Pujols going to the Angels? That’s probably the biggest free agent in baseball since A Rod, and no “insider” knew where he was going.

  10. 60
    Anonymous Says:

    Merry Christmas Eve Eve ABT!

  11. 61
    Leah Says:

    :)

  12. 62
    Anonymous Says:

    It is difficult to tell why the Braves want to move Prado so badly. Yes, he hit just .260 with a measly, Pedro Feliz-esque .302 on-base percentage in 2011, but the 28-year old Prado hit very well in 2008, ’09 and ’10 at six different positions. If the Braves move him for the sake of moving him, or just to save four million dollars, it’s a bad move that makes them worse in the short term.

  13. 63
    Leah Says:

    #62. Very very much like!!!!

  14. 64
    Nate Says:

    Just got 3 baseballs. One signed by Glavine, one by Smoltz, one by Maddux. Would much rather have these than a combo of Halladay, Hamels, and Lee. Go Braves and Merry Xmas to all.

  15. 65
    Steve Says:

    Happy holidays, everyone. I hope you all have a great day with family and friends.

    Nate, what a great gift.

  16. 66
    john j Says:

    Merry Christmas! Just wondering if anyone can see McCann playing another position at times in the future? Playing catcher in Atlanta can be a drain; did it contribute to his collapse at the end of the year?

  17. 67
    Pure Says:

    Ugh – It’s that time of the year when all the baseball write-ups are about “the year in review”. Like we need to re-live it. Fast forward to Spring Training please…

  18. 68
    David Says:

    66 — I doubt they’ll try to move McCann to another position, for several reasons:

    1) being a catcher, he’s naturally bound to have an extremely limited range for defensive purposes. The only other position that he could play would be 1B.
    2) Freddie Freeman is, more than likely, going to be at 1B for a very long time in Atlanta.
    3) Even being a backup 1B would be a huge stretch — NL catchers need to rest on their days off from catching, not playing another position.

    I don’t think being a catcher contributed to his collapse at the end of the year. I think that what did it was a couple of things: the hurricane at the end of August preventing him (and the rest of the Braves) from playing at all, right at a time when they were playing well.

    The other thing — and I’ll admit that this is probably too much Fredi-hating, but I think it’s true — was Fredi Gonzalez resting him on August 26, which was the game against the Mets right before the hurricane hit in NY. McCann hit 2 home runs against the Cubs the day before, and after the game he said that he finally felt like something clicked and on that day, he was seeing the ball better than he had in weeks (he was in a slump at that point). So what does Fredi do the very next day? Rests him. I guess it was because the Braves were facing a lefty (Chris Capuano), but still — if you know that you’re about to miss a couple of days of baseball because of the incoming hurricane, don’t bench McCann.

  19. 69
    Nate Says:

    The Falcons game last night was almost as bad as the Bravos Sept. I’m surprised Brees didn’t give a shout our to Van Gorder for running that terrible zone D all night long. At some point you have to stop Drew Brees, otherwise they won’t win anything for a long time. It’s right there with the Braves having to beat the Phillies. Yeah they’re good, but you gave to find a way to be better.

  20. 70
    Steve Says:

    #68 – I remember being absolutely furious when Fredi sat Mac that day. Mac, after that game, talked about having figured out a bunch of his batting issues and then to be sat. I’m stll incredulous.

    #66 – it would certainly help to be able to move Mac to 1st at some point, but the point about Freddie is a good one. He should be at 1st for a long time and I’m quite confident he can’t play an outfield position.

    Regardless, Mac will surely get another good, long extension.

  21. 71
    Curt Says:

    http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2011/12/rockies-notes-prado-jurrjens-spilborghs.html?utm_medium=facebook&utm_source=twitterfeed

  22. 72
    john j Says:

    71, Smith would still be good for Braves but only at the right price. However, the article mentions Spilborghs who wasn’t 100 % healthy in 2010. He is a great influence on young players and is ready for a much better year. A great #4 outfielder who always hustles. Grab him to round out the bench.

  23. 73
    Leah Says:

    “Deepest sympathies for Jeff Porter and his family. The longtime #Braves head trainer lost his wife in a car accident today in Atlanta.” DOB tweet

    Sad.

  24. 74
    Walker Says:

    Man my condolences go out to the Porter family. Tragic event

  25. 75
    Steve Says:

    Horrible, horrible news about Jeff Porter’s family. Crazy nightmare.

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