Show #183: The Braves Sweep the Cards and Take First Place

1

Walker Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 4:04 am

I understand the lineup looks aesthetically good to have Heyward hitting 7th. However baseball wisdom says that you stack your best hitters at the top of the lineup. You aren’t supposed to even out your lineup with the purposes of putting lesser hitters at the top. Prado is doing well, but we all know what the stats are going to be like at the end of the year. Heck Heyward’s OPS is 50 points higher than Prado’s right now.Bottom line is either Chipper of Heyward need to be hitting 2nd.

Fredi has had the luxury of a big offense, to go along with innings eater like Livan and a great arm like Medlen. So he has no choice but to have better bullpen usage. Last year he had horrible pitchers like Linebrink and Proctor. Not to mention Sherrill was only a situational lefty. An he has gotten extremely lucky. 8 times out of 10 the Cardinals score on Livan in that extra innings game. He refuses to use Kimbrel if it is not a save situation. And in high leverage situations, the choice of Durbin still bothers me. He has handled Chipper well but lets not get out of hand. He is a horrible manager.

I really like Pastornicky. I love hitters that make contact. Oddly enough for McCann, he is making alot of contact, yet the balls aren’t finding any holes. His BABIP must be really low. He’s been really unlucky.

I really want to resign Bourn. He’s been a beast. However with Boras as his agent, I doubt we do. I say the Braves offer no more than 13 million/year for 5 years.

Looking forward to the Rays series and getting McCann and Minor going. Go Braves.

2

Kate Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:31 am

Mac’s BAbip is at .225 right now, his career average is .298.

I’m going to the Friday and Saturday games at the Trop so the Braves will probably lose both.

3

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:24 am

Spreading out the strength of your line-up has been proven faulty about a zillion times. You bunch it up at the top. Scoring in sudden bursts is the most effective way to win games. Sorry I don’t have the links to the articles, but they’re there I promise. It was discussed a lot during the Phillies’ big offensive reign a few years ago, but even before that I’d seen it hashed out a bunch. It’s universally agreed. Once again, though, it’s Fredi versus the Universe.

Great week for the Bravos, though. And really, there’s a limit to the damage even the dumbest manager can do, especially to an offense-first ballteam. However, if this clown gets some kind of manager award this year, I’m going to have a fit.

Kate, that’s good news regarding Mac’s BABIP.

4

George Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 10:49 am

Chipper’s great where he is…he hits into too many DP’s to be in 3rd. Also, it does make the line-up look deeper cause he can get on in front of Heyward and Heyward can knock him in. Also, Minor will improve. He actually pitched much better against St Louis than his line looks. His pitches were generally where McCann wanted them. He just needs to learn where to be careful not to miss at, especially when he pitches inside. Also, McCann was setting up late against St Louis so as not to telegraph location to hitters. I don’t know if they felt St Louis was relaying the location to the hitters or not, but it’s a little more difficult to hit his target if it is setting up late. Fortunately, that problem seems less relevant when Hudson is pitching b/c his pitches run so much and he seems to hit his target by feel (I noticed Huddy doesn’t stay focused on the catcher during his wind up). Fredi is doing okay (IMO), but look to see if we become a little more “streaky” than when Bobby was managing. Bobby usually had many series wins, but swept teams only when the whole team regulars & reserves were playing well. B-Mac looks either hurt or just VERY out of rhythm. If he’s not hurt, he’ll be back to Ol’ Mac, if he’s hurt, then his problems may continue long-term. BTW, Gattis is a BEAST. I’ve been following him since he went to Lynchburg. The Scouts aren’t impressed, but if we lived & died only by scouts, LA Angels would be in first and Puhols would be batting .300. I think Gattis could provide value if he continues to hit in AA.

5

DAP Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 10:58 am

i remember DOB saying last year that several baseball people around the league saw Fredi Gonzalez as a good manager who had a bad year in 2011. I think he is doing a little bit better, in several areas.

dont forget, this guy won a Manager of the Year award.

6

Pure Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 11:00 am

Hammy’s love for Fredi is overflowing in this episode. Curt actually sounded satisfied. Steve is his usual self.

7

George Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 11:11 am

Miami will be tougher than we think. Also, with all their struggles Philadelphia is better than we think. Don’t expect Halladay to continue to lose and when they get Cliff Lee back, I expect they will gain more momentum than they do even when they get Utley & Howard back. They will get a charge when they (Utley & Howard) return more due to walks than their bats, but there is less of a gap than appears; that being said, I am ecstatic that they are this far behind and at the bottom of the division now…we’ll need that boost come the “dog days of summer.” National’s pitching still looks very good and the series between them and us will be exciting…but don’t expect any blow outs. Also, Tampa’s pitching is phenomenal. Atlanta has obviously a better line up, but good pitching beats good hitting 9 times out of 10; that’s why they are atop their division against their Offensive Giant counterparts. How long they can go w/o Longoria is a bit in question.

8

George Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 11:12 am

Good show guys.

9

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 11:13 am

George, I think Utley’s done.

10

Shaun Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 12:23 pm

I agree Fredi is doing a better job. This season he seems to merely be making the same kinds of mistakes that all managers (except Joe Maddon) make. Last season, he went beyond the typical mistakes of just managing by dumb conventions.

The Braves’ usual 1-7 hitters are all pretty similar in terms of overall quality. The way each hitter gets there may be different, but the production or potential production is all pretty similar. And even Pastornicky is no slouch at 8th. That’s a huge reason why batting order hasn’t mattered all that much and probably won’t this season.

11

DAP Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 12:24 pm

Bub and Walker, your criticism of the lineup suggests there is a weakness high in the order. i dont think thats the case. i dont think fredi can make a big mistake with this lineup. although i like heyward or chipper hitting 2nd, you could argue that they are both hitting with enough power, that thier skills are better used lower in the lineup where more runners will potentially be on base.

prado is on base-ing better than heyward, and about the same as chipper, but without their power production. so he isnt a bad option hitting 2nd where he can help bourn set the table for the big dawgs.

again, this is not like fredi batting alex gonzalez 2nd last year (which was inexplicable), the argument can be made that he has all the pieces where they belong.

12

Steve Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 12:42 pm

This is great. Soak it all in…

http://msn.foxsports.com/video/MLB?vid=aa15f71e-adea-494f-805a-1bd5d14c52b3

13

Walker Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 12:43 pm

@DAP

You are right. But We all know Heyward and Chipper will end up having a better obp, ops at the end of the year than Prado. But as long as we are winning, none of it matters. But if we have an extended losing streak, it will.

14

DAP Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 12:53 pm

walker “But We all know Heyward and Chipper will end up having a better obp, ops at the end of the year than Prado.”

youre probably right, but its hardly a given.

“as long as we are winning, none of it matters. But if we have an extended losing streak, it will.”

if we have some sort of extended losing streak, chances are chipper and heyward are not hitting, so moving them up in the lineup might not affect much. no, i think the lineup is fine just like it is, with most every player getting their particular strengths maximized, and alternating lefty, righty.

15

Shaun Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 2:55 pm

I see a Tweet over on the sidebar about SI’s power rankings: “@homeboyupstairs Cards jump to 1st in SI power ranking after sweep at home by Braves (who drop to 5th)”

In fairness to SI, they are trying something different this year with their power rankings. It’s based on underlying performance metrics, not just gut feel or even in-depth projections for the rest of the season or anything like that.

So since we’ve still only seen a sample of about a month-and-a-half, the underlying performance of certain teams could be deceiving and cause them to rank higher or lower than their true talent and where their talent will likely take them.

I pretty much think all power rankings are lame because most sites don’t define what they mean by “power rankings.” This early it’s just kind of ridiculous. There is just not enough of a sample to drastically change one’s mind from preseason predictions or projections. Are you weighing the past month-and-a-half more than talent? Are you looking at projections? Are you look at underlying performance? Too much ambiguity to power rankings. At least SI’s power rankings are clear in terms of how they are actually ranking teams.

16

ham Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 3:08 pm

My dearest Bub, and others-

I agree that there is a mountain of proof/stats about how you should structure your lineup. There are two things that I would counter with:

- Your argument assumes that there are huge differences in the capabilities of the folks in our lineup, which I would argue is not true (of others have mentioned here.) Maybe Heyward has a higher OPS, but I think Prado is more reliable on a day to day basis and is a better situational hitter. (not more clutch necessarily, but more able to produce consistently in a variety of situations).

- secondly, the stats don’t take into effect that we have an “aging” third baseman who is not playing every day (by a long shot), you have a number 7 phenom who is still just as likely to strike out 5 times in a game as he is to hit a game winner. I don’t think moving him to the 2-hole would change any of that. I hate to be a hater, but despite his two clutch hits against the Cards (which don’t happen if he is in the 2 hole, btw), he has looked not so phenomenal as of late.

Let’s be honest – is Fredi all of the sudden Jim Leyland? No. But if we are going to ding Fredi for all the times the players don’t come through in certain situations, we have to give him a little credit when they do come through. You can’t say that the best offense and one of the best records in all of baseball is happening in spite of Fredi.

Yours drooly-
Ham

17

Adam Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 3:11 pm

I feel like Fredi is taking a “If it ain’t broke don’t fix it” approach to our lineup. We have the best offense in the NL. Is it really worth the risk to mess with it?

18

Shaun Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 3:12 pm

SI power rankings are very useful because it gives us an idea which teams have a noticeably better or noticeably worse record than their underlying performance, i.e., which teams are likely to turn things around going forward. And wouldn’t you know it, the Phillies are high on the list of teams with a worse record than their underlying performance.

19

Shaun Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 3:33 pm

ham @16, I agree with most of that.

However, I do think you can say, at least to some degree, that the Braves have one of the best teams in spite of Fredi, simply because I don’t think even the best or worst managers can make all that much of a difference.

That said, as I’ve mentioned, I think Fredi has clearly improved and is now merely making the same mistakes as almost all other managers, not those mistakes plus others.

Also, I’m not sure that if Heyward is better than Prado, even if he’s more likely to have some 0-for-5 games (i.e., is more streaky), the Braves wouldn’t still be better off with Heyward higher in the order. The potential for big games probably makes up for the possibility that Heyward is more likely to have some 0-fers.

All that said, I do think there is something to comfort level of players at certain spots and, I think more importantly, mixing up right-handed and left-handed hitters.

I think this is very different from last season when Schafer led off quite a few times and Alex Gonzalez and Nate McLouth hit second. Even if the lineup is not perfectly optimal, we are not seeing the signs that Fredi merely values speed or “veteran presence” or something at the top of the order, like we saw last season. Maybe that has more to do with the front office drilling it in to Fredi. But if that’s the case, give Fredi credit for listening and getting out of the way of himself.

20

Walker Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 4:33 pm

Lets be clear. The Braves are not playing well because of Fredi Gonzalez. They are playing well because they are talented. I have not watched one game this year where Fredi made a game winning decision. I have seen him make plenty of losing decisions.

21

ham Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 4:43 pm

Walker (in the spirit of healthy debate), isn’t every decision (game winning or game losing) a Fredi decision? Again, I am not advocating that he is a Hall of Famer or anything, but until I get those naked pictures back from him, I feel like I should stick up for him just a little. I also think that a lot of us are carrying the “Fredi is an Idiot” Hammer and everything is starting to look like a nail.

Just having talent does not ensure playing well. Someone has to organize and inspire.

22

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 4:52 pm

I do think they’re playing well in spite of Fredi Gonzalez. Absolutely. But I also thought Prado was a utility player, Chipper had hit his last homerun, and Venters would be in Dr. Andrews’ office by now. But my conviction is what it is, for better or worse. I think Fredi’s an awful manager and however well the Braves play, they’d be a bit (not much) better with a decent manager.

23

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 4:54 pm

(I do think he’s better this year than last year.)

24

Kate Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 5:22 pm

Well, it’s basically impossible for him to be worse than last year.

25

Nate Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 5:34 pm

Good show, guys. It’s hard for me to get past the whole epic collapse thing when it comes to Fredi. If he gets the blame for that then I will give him credit for the way the team is playing. I like his mindset of focusing on this season and not worrying about last year. I think that’s working for everyone on the Braves right now.

However, more credit has to go to Larry Walker and Scott Fletcher and whoever made the decision to add video scouting. The team has an approach at the plate, and it’s working/awesome.

I think credit has to go to the organization for axing LP even though Fredi wanted the whole gang back for a reunion tour in 2012. Remember when Fredi said everyone would be back (coaching staff) right after last season? Good call, Fredi.

26

Walker Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 6:25 pm

The idea of Fredi Gonzalez organizing and inspiring is hilarious.

27

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 6:54 pm

Here, I’ll give ya this: I’d rather have Fredi Gonzalez than any of these:

Bobby Valentine
Dusty Baker
Ozzie Guillien

Fredi’s bad at X’s and O’s, but Dusty Baker is the worst I’ve ever seen. Ever. And the other two are clowns/cancers.

28

Adam Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 7:56 pm

Delgado runs really goofy

29

Leah Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:10 pm

Haven’t had a chance to listen to podcast or read the comments so I’m totally lost. What does this mean:

“Tori Hunter has been placed on restricted list due to a personal matter. Ryan Langerhans will be called up.”

30

Ham Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:12 pm

Again, Walker – I am overstating the Fredi goodness, but you might admit that you’re overstating the badness (a little).

I would still rather have Bobby back.

31

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:15 pm

Delgado’s like a completely different pitcher once he gets in even the slightest bit of trouble.

32

Leah Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:23 pm

Yikes…Rev needs glasses. Or just to look at who’s standing on second.

33

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:25 pm

I love the approach at the plate by this team. It’s not paying off in runs tonight so far, but it’s so much better than the classic 5-pitch innings the Braves were known for not too long ago.

34

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:30 pm

Yeah, don’t know what Pasto was up to there… uhh…

35

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:34 pm

With that ground out, Delgado’s ERA dips to 3.99; now let’s get ‘im some runs.

36

Walker Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:36 pm

Our middle infield defense isn’t the greatest I would say.

37

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:41 pm

I’m calling a little Braves rally right here.

38

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:42 pm

aauuuugh, I swear I typed that BEFORE Bourn’s triple.

39

Leah Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:44 pm

Here it comes! I typed that after Bourn’s triple.

40

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:44 pm

The heller you swinging at, Marteen?

41

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:45 pm

Ah, that. Well, I did say LITTLE rally… :/

42

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:46 pm

Why doesn’t Freddie wanna play along with the Work The Count Boys today?

Oh well, we got this.

43

Leah Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:49 pm

#40 Easy there.

44

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:50 pm

If we had Votto and Hamilton, we’d be set.

45

Leah Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:50 pm

Lead off walk is bad. Even if it’s Votto.

46

Leah Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:53 pm

Haha. Set indeed. Throw in a healthy Matt Kemp while you’re at it.

47

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:53 pm

And that’s why you walk Votto. Well, it’s one reason.

Good inning for Delgado. ERA keeps slidin’ on down.

48

Leah Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:54 pm

You’d a man Martin!

49

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:54 pm

(#47 wasn’t in response to #45; just coincidence)

50

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 8:59 pm

Crap, we’re getting blanton’d again.

51

Leah Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:00 pm

I’m tired of Homer Bailey.

52

Leah Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:01 pm

#49. Good to know. Does that mean your not reading my comments? Cause, we’re kinda the only ones posting.

53

Leah Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:01 pm

*you’re MS public education.

54

Leah Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:02 pm

Delgado needs new britches.

55

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:04 pm

100 pitches for Delgado. Big first out without advancing the runner. Pull him, Fredi. C’mon, be a smart guy.

56

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:05 pm

Leah, I’m reading them, but I missed that one.

57

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:08 pm

Wow, you’re kidding me with letting Homer bat here. Dusty Baker’s dumber than a sack of rocks for real.

58

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:10 pm

YAY, OMG!!! Fredi pulled Delgado at almost the perfect ti… is that … is that … Chad … Durbin?

I hate baseball.

59

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:12 pm

Whew. Sweet Lord that was close. Fredi Gonzalez is a friggin’ moron.

60

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:14 pm

Mark my words: this Fredi-and-Durbin-sittin’-in-a-tree, p-i-tc-h-i-n-g business is going to cost us at least three games.

61

Leah Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:20 pm

I feel like Fredi’s done pretty good this year until I read your comments. Since EVERY time we disagree you’re proven right I feel like a moron.

62

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:21 pm

Wow, Dusty Baker …. serious brain damage. Letting Baily start his 111th pitch versus a lefty, with a lefty right behind him, too.

63

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:23 pm

lol, Leah, not sure if you’re being serious, but I’m wrong so often it isn’t funny. For instance, Bailey just proved Dusty to be okay, I guess. And even if Durbin ALMOST got knocked to Kingdom Come … he didn’t. Quite.

64

Leah Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:25 pm

Totally serious. And…this dude is tall.

65

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:28 pm

My good feeling about this game is waning.

Did you have a good mama’s day?

66

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:31 pm

Man, this ump’s got a strike zone smaller than my … small.

67

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:33 pm

juuuuust a bit outside…

68

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:38 pm

Ugh, don’t understand calling for so many of those 85 mph slider’s from Venters. But then again it got Votto out. Sigh, c’mon, Bravos. Stop it here.

69

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:40 pm

Yuck, Jonny’s off tonight.

70

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:43 pm

lol, was that a straight change from Venters to get that last K?? Weird night.

71

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:45 pm

Nice two-strike single from Prado. Did I lose my princess?

72

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:47 pm

Was Wilson bunting for a hit? Cuz I KNOW Fredi didn’t call a sac bunt with ZERO outs and a TWO run deficit in the EIGHTH.

73

Kate Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:49 pm

He doesn’t know how to manage when they don’t score a lot of runs.

74

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:50 pm

Aroldis Chapman. Good. Good.

75

Leah Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:59 pm

#65. Yes very good. It’s hard to lose after such a great sweep. Come on Braves! Winning is more fun!

76

Leah Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 9:59 pm

Booooooooo…

77

Leah Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 10:00 pm

#71 got a phone call.

78

Leah Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 10:07 pm

Here comes the rally! Poor on the pain! Make them bleed!

79

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 10:10 pm

Will Fredi bat Ross or force Hinske to face a lefty? Well, why did I even ask?

80

Leah Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 10:13 pm

Prado’s about to homer.

81

Leah Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 10:14 pm

Well piddelty poop.

82

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 10:15 pm

Boooo.

Oh well. Nats just won theirs and took back the top spot. But I can’t say this was a hard loss for me. Get ‘em tomorrow. Oh, wait… is it Cueto tomorrow? Get ‘em Wednesday.

83

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 10:47 pm

We haven’t won on a Monday this season, according to AbswAgain at mlb.com. Outscored 66-13 on Mondays. Can that be real?

84

Shaun Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 10:48 pm

“Just having talent does not ensure playing well. Someone has to organize and inspire.”

ham @21, sorry I’m late to the party in continuing the Fredi discussion from earlier.

I don’t think it’s a matter of whether or not Fredi organizes and inspires (and makes good tactical moves). It’s a matter of how much better Fredi does these things compared to other managers. I think most managers who reach the majors and have any kind of career there are good at organizing and inspiring and are decent tactically, up to a certain level.

I believe Fredi was worse than most managers last season. This season, while I don’t think he’s really any better than the vast majority of big league managers, I don’t think he’s any worse either.

Now, instead of being a manager that probably cost his team relative to the typical manager, I think he’s basically just another manager. This is not necessarily a bad thing. It’s nice when you’re manager isn’t a story and he just kind of fades into the background as another piece of the team.

Now tactically, I honestly don’t think there are very many managers who set themselves apart. Most managers manage based on backassward conventions (managing to the save rule, wasting the number two spot in the order on a weak contact hitter and things of that sort). Some are worse than others (Jim Tracy comes to mind) while some are better (Joe Maddon is the most obvious progressive-minded manager). But most are going to stick to the convictions and traditions that aren’t going to set them apart. I think Fredi is in this class this year, while he was more in the Jim Tracy class last year.

85

Curt Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 10:48 pm

We never win on a Monday after a 7-2 road trip against a guy who has been getting rocked all year. Ask Ham, he’ll tell you.

86

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 10:52 pm

#84, I might begrudgingly go along with all of that.

87

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 10:53 pm

I really, REALLY thought Venters would be done by now. Do we think this is a harbinger of bad arm health, or just a bump in the road?

88

Bubdylan Says:
May 14th, 2012 at 10:54 pm

*by “done,” I mean hurt.

89

Curt Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 7:38 am

If he’s hurt, so is EOF.

Say one thing about the Braves, when they lose now they sure do look bad doing it.

90

Bubdylan Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 10:56 am

Curt, I didn’t think they looked bad. They went deep into counts for the most part. Uggla had a similar ten-pitch at bat to Heyward’s game-winner, just didn’t end the same. Delgado looked pretty good. The Uggla/Pastornicky mix-up was goofy, but I thought they played a good game for the most part and just lost it. Venters’ bad night was most of the story.

91

Walker Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 11:45 am

After being declared the best team in the NL we can’t let the Reds sweep us.

92

Curt Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 12:31 pm

Maybe ‘bad’ was hyperbolic. I just meant that they score 100 runs a game, except when they lose and they score 1. Or 0. Not many 6-5 losses recently.

To All: Please now post all the Braves losses on the year and their exact score to prove me wrong.

Thanks,
Mgmt.

93

Steve Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 12:59 pm

@92: Just to save time: “Curt, you’re wrong and you hate puppies and kittens.”

94

Steve Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 1:02 pm

“The idea of Fredi Gonzalez organizing and inspiring is hilarious.”

I really do hate to be a Fredi proponent, but does no credit go to him for the can do attitude and heads held high we see in the club this year after the historic collapse? I get that this comparison is kind of cheating, but look at what Boston’s doing after their epic collapse. Very different results so far between the two teams.

95

Walker Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 2:05 pm

@ Steve

Fredi does share Bobby Cox’s temperament which is a far cry from Bobby Valentine. However, coming into the season I knew the Redsox were not as talented as the Rays and Yankees. The Blue Jays are also better. They had no LF or SS coming into the season and their rotation was iffy. I guess my point is that the Red Sox aren’t as good as the Braves.

I will give Fredi credit for letting his team play a little more this year and not injecting his stupidity as much. I’m sorry I just don’t like the guy. Shoot me.

96

Shaun Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 2:09 pm

I credit Fredi for improving. He hasn’t inserted crap at the top of the order, no bases-loaded squeeze attempts, etc.

I’m not sure how much better he is at organizing and inspiring than other managers. I would guess most guys even considered for major league jobs are pretty good at organizing and can be fairly inspirational.

97

Shaun Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 2:15 pm

One caveat to my last post. I suspect Bobby Cox stood out as a manager who did better than most when it came to inspiring. Has there ever been a manager in baseball who gave off more of an air to the players of “we’re in this together”? The man wore metal spikes even when he got up there in age, was constantly cheering his players on and of course wasn’t afraid to get tossed if his players felt they had been wronged.

I don’t know if Fredi will ever be that kind of guy. But I think tactically he looks to be moving closer to Bobby than he was last season, which is not a bad thing.

98

Walker Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 3:00 pm

Bobby was one of the greatest. He is a example of a manager making the difference in his team especially when we made the playoffs in 2010. We won the Wild Card by 1 game.When he made that decision to bat Prado and Heyward at the top, we took off. Managing a team that won 14 straight division titles with so many moving parts is a amazing accomplishment. Like I always said, If Lonnie Smith was actually paying attention to the game he would have had 2 WS championships.

99

Bubdylan Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 3:41 pm

Sigh.

http://tinyurl.com/bmvaxnl

100

Anne Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 3:46 pm

Thanks to a co-worker, I’ll be at tomorrow’s Braves v Marlins game. Where else: out in left field.

101

David Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 5:38 pm

Great show once again, guys. I know that last night’s game sucked, but all Monday games have sucked this season.

As I was listening to the show yesterday afternoon, I came up with my own “good sign” for the week — actually, it’s for the season. It’s the health of this team. The team that’s on the field now is the same team that was on the field on Opening Day, with the good exception of Chipper’s presence in the lineup now.

Look around our division, and that’s something the other teams are lacking. Phillies and Washington are beat up, and now the Dodgers are without Kemp for a while. Do we think that this team would be where it is if we lost one or more of McCann (like Nats’ Ramos), Heyward (Werth), Kimbrel (Storen), Freeman (like Phils’ Howard) or Uggla (Utley)? I’m glad that we don’t have to face that — current, hopefully non-serious eye problems with Freeman notwithstanding.

And on this note: I think the games over the next 2-3 months are especially important, given that the other legit teams in our division are hurt. I’d much rather have a comfortable lead when those injured players come back than have their returns be the added boost that gets them over the hump.

102

Leah Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 5:46 pm

http://t.co/sSiB1mJh.

Pure awesomeness!

103

Bubdylan Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 7:26 pm

Lots of flyouts so far for Huddy.

104

Bubdylan Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 7:40 pm

Mac.

105

Bubdylan Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 7:58 pm

Marteeeeen! Who ARE these people??

106

Bubdylan Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 7:59 pm

Jones!

Nice little rally!

107

Walker Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 8:00 pm

Baseball is so unpredictable. I thought we would be hitting like this against Homer Bailey, not Cueto.

Go Braves!

108

Bubdylan Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 8:01 pm

Uggla! Everybody’s playin’!

109

Leah Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 8:06 pm

Walker. It’s Not Monday. Explains everything. Go Bravos!

110

Bubdylan Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 8:09 pm

What a freaking thing of beauty that at-bat was by Heyward. Down two strikes, worked it full, fouled off four good pitches, and then BOOM, double.

111

Bubdylan Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 8:11 pm

Tiny ERA, meet the Braves.
Braves, meet … hey, where did Tiny ERA go? He was just here.

112

Anne Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 8:28 pm

Leah, your man is having quite the night!

113

Walker Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 8:28 pm

Where are those people who wanted to trade Martin Prado so bad?

114

Bubdylan Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 8:29 pm

Everybody but Uggla has at least one hit or one walk, and Uggla has an RBI sac fly. In the fourth inning!

115

will Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 8:31 pm

this is better

116

Leah Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 8:32 pm

Yowzers! Killin’ it!

117

Leah Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 8:33 pm

#113 Let me at ‘em.

118

Bubdylan Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 8:37 pm

I think this offense might hang 25 runs on somebody this year.

119

Bubdylan Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 8:44 pm

ANOTHER beautiful, long at bat. Chased Cueto in four innings, and we’ve cost this guy eleven pitches so far without recording an out.

120

Leah Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 9:10 pm

Prado-is-fantastic!!!

121

Leah Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 9:12 pm

Come on Blue Eyes! Hit a homer just for kicks!

122

Bubdylan Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 9:15 pm

Love our offense, but I have to admit this game from Huddy is one of the luckiest I’ve seen him pitch. I’ll take it all day, but he’s been up in the zone.

123

Bubdylan Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 9:17 pm

Crap; me and my big mouth.

124

Bubdylan Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 9:18 pm

Uh, Fredi, little help?

125

Bubdylan Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 9:21 pm

Whew.

126

Bubdylan Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 9:27 pm

J. J. Hoover would be the first pitcher to make short work of the Braves all night.

127

Bubdylan Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 9:57 pm

Kimbrel hitting 99mph tonight. Nice.

128

Bubdylan Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 10:00 pm

Sigh… Craig … please get the last out.

129

Bubdylan Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 10:01 pm

Woo hoo! Out 3! Hello, First Place, haven’t I seen you somewhere before?

130

Leah Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 10:28 pm

You know why I like Fredi? Cause he didn’t take crap from Hanley Ramirez. Illogical, I know.

Also, remember last year everytime J-Hey was hitting 2nd he floundered? He just does not succeed in that spot. He presses and doesn’t have awesome 12 pitch at bats ending in doubles.

131

David Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 11:15 pm

Add Cueto to the list of starting pitchers who were having a good stretch and then ran into the Braves:

Santana (4/17)
Dickey (4/18, ended his quality starts steak)
Cahill (4/20)
Correia (4/29)
Halladay (5/2)
Lynn (5/13)
Cueyo (5/15)

132

Bubdylan Says:
May 15th, 2012 at 11:24 pm

#131, awesome post.

133

Walker Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 3:45 am

@130

Jason Heyward struggled just in general last year. It didn’t matter where he hit.

134

David Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 6:22 am

132, thanks. It really is amazing how well they’re doing against dominant pitching. Of course, there have been pitchers who have done the opposite (Capuano, Bedard, Samarjdiza, etc), but who wants to look at THAT list?!?!?

And in my original post, I obviously meant Cueto, not Cueyo.

135

Curt Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:53 am

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/mlb-big-league-stew/stephen-strasburg-hot-stuff-ointment-apparently-not-very-232204762.html

136

Anne Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 8:32 am

#135 – Ha! Kilgore SO purposefully dropped the word, “jocularity” in that story.

137

Bubdylan Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 9:09 am

#135, that photo of Strasburg in the rain is one of the best baseball photos I’ve seen in ten years. Not a big fan of the guy, but that shot is just badass.

138

Nate Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 10:55 am

I guess Mickey Hatcher is the fall guy in the whole Pujols hitting epidemic. I bet Mickey thought that job was going to be a lot easier.

139

Leah Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 11:18 am

I accidentally clicked “see all” and can’t get page breaks back. Oh remember the days of 100s of comments and no page breaks?

140

Leah Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 11:19 am

Haha! Just fixed itself! Very smart website ya got here.

141

Pure Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 12:56 pm

Looking ahead — what do we do if Minor has another bad start? Bring up JJ or Teheran? Start stretching out Medlen and make him a starter again?

142

Nate Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 1:23 pm

#141, great question. Jair Francoise Jurrjens pitches for the G Braves tonight and Minor for The Braves. In 3 games at AAA JJ is 2-0 with a 2.05 ERA, but he’s still giving up too many hits. He gave up 8 hits to the Toledo Mudhens in his last start.

I would think Medlen stays in the ‘pen. He’s been arguably our most consistent reliever.

143

Bubdylan Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 2:43 pm

We’re about to find out what we’re made of. Courtesy of bravehomer at mlb.com:

2 vs. Marlins
3 @ Tampa Bay
4 @ Cincinnati
3 vs. Washington
3 vs. St. Louis
3 @ Washington
3 @ Miami
3 vs. Blue Jays
3 vs. Yankees
3 vs. Orioles
3 @ Yankees
3 @ Boston
3 vs. Arizona
3 vs. Washington

23 – home
19 – road

144

Pure Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 3:40 pm

Has anyone tried checking Hammy’s claim that we never ever win the first game in a series at LA?

145

Anne Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 3:58 pm

Sitting in left field tonight AND Diaz is playing…I’ve died and gone to heaven. Thanks, what-I-can-only-assume-is-a Marlins left-handed pitcher!

146

Bubdylan Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 4:11 pm

Sigh, okay, since it IS summertime, I’ll do it:

2011 first game @ Dodgers: April 18, loss 2 – 4 (lost 3 of 4 in series)

2010: June 3, won 4-3 (split series 2 and 2)

2009: August 6, lost 5-4 (won the other three games)

2008: July 7, lost 3-0 (lost 2 of 3)

2007: July 2, lost 8-2 (split series)

2006: April 3, won 11-10 (won 2 of 3)

2005: May 13, lost 7-4 (won 2 of 3)

2004: August 19, won 6 to 5 (split 2 and 2)

2003: May 12, won 11 – 4 (won 2 of 3)

2002: August 23, lost 4-3, (lost 2 of 3)

So 4-6 in the last 10 years,
but 1-4 in the last 5 years.

So, citing Cherry-picking Code #875,233,419, I give the claim a pass. Barely.

147

Curt Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 4:13 pm

Heyward is starting in CF. Bourn getting a day off.

148

Bubdylan Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 4:26 pm

Don’t understand giving star players as many days off as Fredi likes, but whatever. It’s not like a day off from an 8 hour job. It’s 3 hours, in which a player has to run 90 feet from 3 to 10 times, and run and catch a half dozen fly balls or grounders. Plus warm ups, etc.

149

Walker Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 4:48 pm

I guess the days off are because of squeeze week.

150

Leah Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 5:12 pm

#145 Anne, if you scream “I love you Matt!” maybe he’ll tip his cap to you like he did to me two years ago. Have so much fun!

151

Walker Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 5:30 pm

Pastornicky has the worst OBP on the team yet he’s leading off.

152

Bubdylan Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 6:28 pm

See, I was just getting myself psyched up to believe the combination of good talent on the Braves team and Fredi’s calming down of his COMPLETELY STUPID $%&*^ CHOICES OF $*&@# BASEBALL $*&&+@! INCOMPETENT %$@CLOWN FFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUDDDDDGGGGGING #@%$ MANAGERIAL $#@%BUTT $#%MORONIDIOCY #@$% … were too much to really cost the team any games. What was I thinking? He’s going to cost us games. I guess I can just hope it’s not too many games. Like, you know, last year.

Sigh, what hurts about a tragedy is always what the possibilities were without the fatal flaw.

*pokes out both eyes with two Heyward bobbleheads*

Medic!

153

Anne Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 6:47 pm

Greetings from the rarified air of the 755 Club. Looks like another low turnout but time to spare. Go Braves!!

154

Walker Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:03 pm

I don’t care if I’m repetitive. But Fredi is just really stupid. I wonder what his IQ is?

155

Bubdylan Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:07 pm

4

156

Walker Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:09 pm

And the sad thing (and good thing) is that Pastornicky is going to go 5 for 5 tonight with 2 HRs and 8 RBIs.

157

Anne Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:10 pm

Diaz in…center??? Must be my restraining order.

158

Anne Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:11 pm

Oh…I see. Right field. It’s absolutely my restraining order.

159

Bubdylan Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:13 pm

Says you. My money is on Pasto going 0 for 3 before being ejected for punching his own manager in the face and screaming “CUZ I DON’T HAVE ENOUGH PROBLEMS ALREADY LOBBING THE BALL TO THE GHOST MAN ON SECOND, NOW I GOTTA LEAD OFF, MR. MAYBE-SIMMONS-SHOULD-START!!!”

160

Bubdylan Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:16 pm

Diaz is in RF?

…

HHHHHHHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

…

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAH!

Five bucks says Matty gets McLouthed by Heyward by the third inning.

161

Anne Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:19 pm

That’s it, Tyler. Prove em wrong.

162

Bubdylan Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:19 pm

Single Pasto, lol, of freaking course.

163

Bubdylan Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:20 pm

Caught stealing in 5 … 4 … 3 …

164

Anne Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:20 pm

Oh Bub of little faith.

165

Bubdylan Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:21 pm

Huh… Marteen doubles. Reckon I’ll shut up.

166

Bubdylan Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:22 pm

6 pitches, one run. I like it so far.

167

Adam Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:22 pm

And Pastornicky scores the first run. Nice.

168

Bubdylan Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:22 pm

Never doubted him.

169

Bubdylan Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:23 pm

It only happened because the universe hates me. So, you all have me to thank. I accept gift certificates.

170

Adam Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:24 pm

@168: “My money is on Pasto going 0 for 3 before being ejected for punching his own manager in the face…”

absolutely.

171

Bubdylan Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:25 pm

My money, Adam, but not my heart. Never my heart. 8)

172

Bubdylan Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:32 pm

Diazzzzz with the putout.

173

Anne Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:45 pm

My old usher buddy, Alan, is happily still roaming section 211. Guess where I’m sitting now? Go Braves!!

174

Bubdylan Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:48 pm

Oh well. He’s still batting .500 in the leadoff spot for his career.

175

Bubdylan Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:55 pm

Maybe he meant, “play me, trade me, or demote me.”

176

Bubdylan Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 7:58 pm

Mike Minor’s walk-up music:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_pFbfXZSseU

177

Steve Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 8:09 pm

A 9 pitch at bat to Buehrle. yikes

178

Adam Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 8:28 pm

This game is starting to look ugly.

179

Nate Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 8:28 pm

JJ has given up 8 through 4 IP for Gwinnett. Yikes.

180

Anne Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 8:29 pm

That double steal was kind of beautiful. Yeah, I know. It was the other guys.

181

Pure Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 8:32 pm

I think we all saw this coming.

182

Nate Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 8:34 pm

Whatever, their uniforms still suck. So there’s that. At least our guys look badass.

183

Anne Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 8:35 pm

The weather here is great…and that’s about the entirety of the great.

184

Nate Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 8:37 pm

“it’s hard to put on a Bonifacio with a 6-1 deficit” – Chip Caray

It’s like salt on an open wound.

185

Nate Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 8:41 pm

This may not be a great week with Shields and Price looming this weekend.

186

Adam Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 9:16 pm

The heck is he doing going for 3rd down by 4 with no outs?

187

Walker Says:
May 16th, 2012 at 10:02 pm

Great start Minor, ya bum.

I kid, I kid, Roger needs to figure out what wrong with him ASAP.

188

Jo-Bu Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 11:31 am

Minor should have never taunted the baseball gods in his spring training remarks. Every ballplayer knows the gods always get the final say. Don’t talk the talk unless you can walk the walk.

189

Nate Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 2:04 pm

From Talking Chop:
Minor in 2012 with bases empty: .226/.282/.339 … .621 OPS
Minor in 2012 with runners on: .422/..461/.766 … 1.226 OPS

190

Bubdylan Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 2:53 pm

#189, so it’s a confidence problem? What good is arrogance if it doesn’t give you confidence?? Boo. Chuck James, Jo Jo Reyes, Mike Minor … maybe Atlanta’s quest for a lefty starter should just end.

191

Adam Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 7:32 pm

Runner on 3rd with 0 outs and we can’t get the run home. That’s a bad sign.

192

Steve Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 8:25 pm

@191 – I think the only bad sign is the pitching at this point (Minor, JJ, a little Venters)

193

ham Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 8:57 pm

Hard to argue with the lineup tonight.

194

Curt Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 9:09 pm

As night follows day, the Braves follow a loss with an ass kicking.

195

Nate Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 9:21 pm

Beachy looks so freaking great!

196

Shaun Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 9:21 pm

Chip Carey and Joe Simpson were just talking about Stanton as a guy to consider starting a franchise with and that Stanton, Heyward and Freeman were all taken in the same draft (2007).

Heyward has 9.5 career Wins Above Replacement per Baseball Reference.
Stanton has 7.6 WAR per B-R.

Heyward has 8.5 career WAR per FanGraphs.
Stanton has 8.1.

And that’s with a rather poor offense season from Heyward in 2011.

I think it’s because Heyward’s offensive issues were a little bit overblown (though they were real) and he is underrated defensively.

197

Shaun Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 9:24 pm

Matt Chernoff ‏@RealMattlanta: “Another outstanding effort from Brandon Beachy… #Braves”

198

Nate Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 9:25 pm

#196, hard debate between two freak athletes. I give the edge to Stanton because he has more power and is more durable. Plus, Stanton’s improved a lot at the plate since he’s been in the league, no reason to think he won’t continue his improvement. He’s a better defensive outfielder than Heyward, too. I don’t think you could go wrong with either, but I would take Freddie over both.

199

Nate Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 9:30 pm

I think they mentioned last night that Stanton got a scholarship offer from Pete Carroll to be either a DB or WR. That’s pretty impressive.

200

Leah Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 9:31 pm

Rev just said a bad word.

201

Walker Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 9:41 pm

@198

You would take Freddie Freeman over Heyward and Stanton? Wow. OK then

202

Nate Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 9:46 pm

*my bad, Freddie over Heyward or Stanton is what I meant. I think Freddie’s the best of the 3.

203

Walker Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 9:52 pm

Still Freddie over Heyward or Stanton? Wow I disagree there. Heyward’s ceiling is infinitely higher than Freddie’s.

204

Walker Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 9:52 pm

Complete game shutout!!! An ace in the making people.

205

Leah Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 9:53 pm

I believe BB!

206

Leah Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 9:54 pm

Sometimes a doubt Chip’s ability to put words together to make a sentence.

207

Bubdylan Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 9:54 pm

Wow, that was one of the best games all year. What a performance from Beachy.

208

Bubdylan Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 9:55 pm

#206, lol @ irony.

209

Pure Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 9:55 pm

Impressive.

210

Nate Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 9:56 pm

When was the last time a Brave pitched a complete game shutout?

211

Bubdylan Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 9:58 pm

Probably Huddy, Nate, but the last time a non-Huddy Brave pitched one I just have no idea.

212

Bubdylan Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 10:01 pm

Hanrahan’s tryin’ to poop in our soup. C’mon, Pirates, put it away.

213

Bubdylan Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 10:07 pm

Woo Hoo! First place again. Ssssssolid.

214

Shaun Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 10:09 pm

Nate @198, I think Heyward will end up being the more complete hitter while Stanton will clearly have the power edge, no doubt about it. Also, Heyward looks like the more complete player.

It’s tough to go with Freddie. I don’t think he’ll have the offensive value of either Heyward or Stanton plus the whole positional scarcity thing. Firstbasemen have to hit a ton to be one of the top players. But, not to knock the guy. He’s going to be plenty valuable and steady for a long time.

215

David Says:
May 17th, 2012 at 10:31 pm

I was at the game tonight and was one row and five ppl away from catching freeman’s HR ball tonight. If you watch the clip, I’m the dude in the green tshirt.

One of the best games all season. Good sign of the week? How about that we have a SP more deserving of starting the All Star Game than JJ was last season!

216

will Says:
May 18th, 2012 at 6:00 am

Phillies have won 5 in a row…

217

Nate Says:
May 18th, 2012 at 7:37 am

#214, 203, it seems to me that Jason has the most growing to do at the plate, and if they move him to CF next year, there’s another adjustment he has to make. I think you guys are right that he has a high ceiling, but I really don’t see how it’s that much higher than Freddie’s or Giancarlo Stanton. Both of those guys have made faster adjustments to MLB than Heyward, imo. Again, this is just my opinion. All 3 are really good, young players, I just don’t see the big difference you guys see is all. I would have never said this a year ago, but I don’t think you can ignore what Freeman is doing and what Jason did last year.

218

Shaun Says:
May 18th, 2012 at 8:50 am

Nate @217, Freeman and Heyward weren’t as far apart last season as people think, once you factor in defense and positional scarcity.

Baseball Reference had Freeman up by only 0.1 WAR while FanGraphs had Heyward up by 1.2 WAR.

I think Heyward’s tools and skills (particularly his plate-discipline) bode well for his future compared to Freeman, if we are simply forced to compare the two.

I agree that I would take all three–Heyward, Stanton and Freeman–and it’s tough to find anything wrong with any of them.

219

Nate Says:
May 18th, 2012 at 9:11 am

Shaun, what’s your opinion on resigning Bourn? Is he worth what he will cost?

Thanks for the response on the Heyward/Freeman stuff. I’m not a big stats guy, so I like hearing that point of view on baseball. I actually looked into some of Heyward’s defensive stuff last night and was surprised at how great of an outfielder he is statistically. Do any of the defensive stats take into account how many throwing errors Freeman saves with his glove?

One last thing on Freddie, I think we’ll see an increase in his power numbers as he gets stronger. I read somewhere that he just started lifting this past offseason. He said he started out benching 160, which is kind of pathetic for a guy his size, but was up in the 260s after Winter.

220

Curt Says:
May 18th, 2012 at 9:40 am

#210 – Beachy’s was the first shutout by a Brave since Jair Jurrjens did it last July 1 against Baltimore.

221

Shaun Says:
May 18th, 2012 at 12:52 pm

Nate @219, I’m honestly not that big a stats guy either, believe it or not. I’m more of an evidence guy, if that makes sense. Stats are just the best place to get the evidence in baseball because it’s impossible to watch every play of every player, and you need that for comparison. Even if you watch every play of every player on your favorite team, it still doesn’t give you enough info because you aren’t comparing them to other players and getting a sense of how good he is relative to the competition.

That’s not to say watching isn’t extremely important. Obviously you can’t get a sense of a guy’s tools just from stats.

I don’t know that any stats do a great job measuring how good Freeman is at receiving throws. I read something, I believe on FanGraphs, before Freeman came to the majors that the best scooping firstbasemen do not save a huge number of runs relative to the worst. I think Freeman is good at it, no doubt, but I’m not sure that the impact is significant relative to other firstbasemen. I think most guys capable of playing a solid firstbase in the majors do a pretty good job receiving throws. Some are no doubt better than others but I’m just not sure it’s possible to make a huge impact in that way.

I think Freddie’s range is probably mediocre, maybe worse. But I don’t think he’s a bad firstbaseman. And he’s going to have offensive value, even for a firstbaseman.

Geez, sounds like I’m bashing Freeman but that’s not my intention. Just trying to give as honest assessment as I can based on the info I’m seeing. He’s a fine player. I just think Heyward has all the tools and skills to be a superstar or something close to it. The future is bright with those two in the lineup.

I think Freddie will gain more power, as you say. And his hit tool is just fine. It looks like he may struggle with plate discipline, but probably not enough to make him less than a very good player. I think that is just what will push Heyward over him as both players develop.

222

Shaun Says:
May 18th, 2012 at 12:58 pm

Oh, and I think what we’re seeing now is Bourn’s upside offensively. I can’t see him being much better than this at any point during his next contract. He may be worth a significant offer because I still think he can be solid with the bat for a few more years and he’ll be a very good defender and baserunner for a while longer. It seems people are finally starting to take notice that he’s something close to an elite defensive player. He’s not Andruw in his prime but he’s the best we’ve seen since Andruw.

It will probably depend on the Braves’ other options and whether Bourn is wanting to really break the bank. I could see he and the Braves meeting halfway or I could see some team going crazy and offering him a huge deal.

223

Nate Says:
May 18th, 2012 at 2:00 pm

I think I gotcha now. I definitely don’t really watch anyone but the Braves and who they are playing that game. When I lived in TB I used to watch the Rays a lot because they’re an easy bunch to root for, but I don’t really see many other teams play that frequently. Plus with 1B, most of the best players are in the AL now, anyway, so we Braves fans don’t really get to see them play much. Freddie’s offensive game reminds me a lot of Evan Longoria. Both guys could hit .300, but they’re more likely to hit in the .280 range with high 20s low 30s in HR, and between 80-100 RBI. Not exactly the same type of offensive player as a Fielder, Howard, Adrien Gonzalez, or even Pujols when he is hitting. So, Freddie’s not really an elite player at his own position.

As far as Jason goes, my hope is that one day it just starts clicking and we see Matt Kemp like production. He definitely has the tools to play at that level. Freddie doesn’t really have the tools to reach the level of the elite 1B. He can be very good, like you said, but probably never elite level talent at that position.

I hope we resign Bourn. When we traded for him it felt like we had finally found the missing piece to our offense. Then Greg Walker and Scott Fletcher made it all work.

224

Walker Says:
May 18th, 2012 at 10:23 pm

10 games over .500 and a 1.5 game lead. Let’s take off from here boys.

225

Steve Says:
May 18th, 2012 at 11:28 pm

@215: funny, I had that same exact thought last night after the shutout.

And what a tremendous win tonight in Tampa. Tough AL team, on the road, getting timely hitting, great pitching. This team is fun to watch.

226

Leah Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 9:29 am

My kid is pitching today for the first time. I don’t know what to do with myself.

227

Curt Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 4:44 pm

How did it go?

228

Leah Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 5:19 pm

It’s getting ugly for Delgado.

229

Leah Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 5:22 pm

@227 Pretty good. Walked a couple, struck out one, two 1-3 outs so fielded well. Thanks for asking! Can see video of strikeout on my wall since, ya know, we’re friends and all. He almost took the kids head off. I guess he was crowding the plate a little.

230

Bubdylan Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 5:24 pm

Big innings are Delgado’s and Minor’s nemeses.

231

Bubdylan Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 5:30 pm

Then again, the kid’s pitching a two-hitter.

232

Bubdylan Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 5:36 pm

Congrats to the youngun, Leah.

233

Bubdylan Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 5:41 pm

Sigh, again Delgado looks great until one guy dinks a hit. Now can’t find the strike zone. Paging John Smoltz’s shrink…

234

Bubdylan Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 5:51 pm

Cobb threw 6 straight changeups to Uggla. Don’t know that I’ve ever seen that.

235

Bubdylan Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 6:04 pm

Strike zone, mutha$%^&*^, do you speak it?!

236

Leah Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 6:12 pm

Man, gotta get Chipper back. Can’t seem to win on Mondays or without Chipper.

237

Leah Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 6:14 pm

Martinez covered his mouth with his hat so he could swear in private…in Spanish no doubt.

238

Bubdylan Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 6:16 pm

What’s the story on TB’s bullpen? Is it good?

239

Bubdylan Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 6:20 pm

Yikes. Just visited fangraphs. Their pen is pretty great.

240

Kate Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 6:28 pm

Does this game suck as much on TV as it does live at the Trop.

241

Bubdylan Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 6:31 pm

They seem pretty out of it on tv. Is that way live? This pitching change is the first sign from them I’ve seen that they plan on still trying to stay in the game.

242

Bubdylan Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 6:33 pm

Oh good. We walked someone.

243

Bubdylan Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 6:36 pm

Braves pitchers’ve walked 7 Rays so far.

244

Bubdylan Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 6:37 pm

Big sticks due up for the Braves. I’m putting on my rally hat. My JSU straw hat worn sideways. I’m old.

245

Kate Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 6:39 pm

Have the Braves at least been swinging at strikes? I can’t tell from where I’m sitting.

246

Bubdylan Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 6:41 pm

Yeah, seems to me like they have. Just not hitting ‘em much.

247

Bubdylan Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 6:43 pm

13 Braves in a row retired. Ya can’t tell me this game ain’t mental.

248

Bubdylan Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 6:45 pm

Monday’s game should be a hoot. We haven’t won on Monday yet, plus it’s Mike Minor (7.09) versus Mike Leake (0-5, 6.21). Should be a high scoring affair. So, probly lose it 1 – 0 in the 19th inning.

249

Bubdylan Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 6:53 pm

Crap, I missed that. Says McCann caught somebody stealing. Did the guy fall down?

250

Leah Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 6:59 pm

Does this one go into the ” win some lose some” bucket?

251

Bubdylan Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 7:03 pm

I’m putting it into the “gonna go watch ‘There Will Be Blood’ to cheer myself up now” bucket.

252

Leah Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 7:04 pm

Kinda glad Minor pitches on Monday. Two birds one stone.

253

Bubdylan Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 7:17 pm

Maybe we can trade for Lowe. We could offer to pick up 2/3 of his salary.

254

Bubdylan Says:
May 19th, 2012 at 10:56 pm

Looks like the whole division lost. No harm no foul, I guess.

255

Curt Says:
May 20th, 2012 at 2:58 pm

Need some runs here people

256

Walker Says:
May 20th, 2012 at 4:03 pm

Good I can’t stand that d -bag Luke Scott.

257

Jess Says:
May 20th, 2012 at 4:14 pm

Looks like you guys hit every nail on the head with your predictions this week.

258

Walker Says:
May 20th, 2012 at 4:31 pm

Leake, Bailey, and Arroyo

We should bang the ball around.

WE can get to Latos too.

259

David Says:
May 20th, 2012 at 9:32 pm

I was gone all day and missed today’s game, but I just watched replays of where Pena got hit by the ball. I think that we got lucky, but I also think that, if it didn’t hit him, Uggla would’ve been close enough to have gotten it and thrown him out.

Great series, and a good week all around — 4-3, not bad. I’ll take that any week.

260

Bubdylan Says:
May 20th, 2012 at 10:44 pm

David, I thought Uggs had it as well. Unless he dove PAST it. He definitely was at least to its path.

Show #183: The Braves Sweep the Cards and Take First Place

260 Responses to “Show #183: The Braves Sweep the Cards and Take First Place”

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