Show #205: The Braves 2012 Season Wrap Up

October 15, 2012

Show #205: The Braves 2012 Season Wrap Up

Team MVP and LVP. Our one 2012 Do Over. The Wren Extension. And what will the outfield look like in 2013?

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76 Responses to “Show #205: The Braves 2012 Season Wrap Up”

1
Bubdylan Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 12:46 am
Good show.

lolololololololololol @ Juan Pierre’s 17 HR’s this year and even more lulz at nobody immediately going “WHAT???” If that noodle-arm is our CF on opening day, I’m buying the 1995 season on VHS and watching that all year instead. If it’s Shane Victorino, I’m going to re-watch the Cardinals-Braves one game play off 162 times. Because that would be less painful.

Happy offseason.
2
Walker Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 4:43 am
You heard it here first.

Justin Upton and Denard Span are Braves next year.
3
Leah Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 8:30 am
Thank you Steve for saving the podcast. Had you picked Chipper as your MVP over Prado I would have fired you all! We absolutely win the WC playoff game had our veteran/captain not thrown the ball into center field. He said as much himself in the post game interview. Think of all the times Prado was moved around the diamond and played like he was born there. Mercy people!

If Pierre is a Brave we’ll save money on helmets. His head is so tiny his batting helmet has to be almost free.
4
ham Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 9:23 am
I have to admit that my idiotality is at a near alltime high on this one. Sorry. Just saying that if we go big on a LF, then we may only be able to afford Pierre.
5
Shaun Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 10:22 am
Omar Minaya did trade away Cliff Lee, Grady Sizemore, Brandon Phillips, Jason Bay, Carl Pavano, while with the Expos.
6
Steve Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 10:27 am
@3 – Good call on all the positions that Prado played as well. Looking like a gold glover even at SS (his “worst” position).
7
will Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 10:42 am
Most improved: Heyward
8
Steve Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 11:41 am
@7: I’d throw Minor in that category, too.
9
Bubdylan Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 12:00 pm
ham, if I was recording a podcast and had to pull up stats or ideas, thinking on my feet, I’d be lucky to remember the name of the team I root for.

Anyway maybe the joke’s on me. Pierre’s BABIP and wOBA were in line with his averages; maybe he could hit .290+ in ATL for cheap dollars.

Victorino’s got twice the WAR of Pierre, last year and beyond. I’ll just have to watch all his at-bats on gameday and then return to the tv when the next guy comes up. If I can find a way to have Shane on the team and never see his face, I could go for it. He does fit Wren’s “couple of expensive players instead of one ridiculous contract” model.
10
Shaun Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 12:13 pm
I think Prado, Bourn and Heyward would have all been fine choices for MVP. Remember when Raul Mondesi and Brian Jordan maned the Braves’ outfield?

LVP candidates: Pastornicky, Hinske and Jurrjens.

I really though Pastornicky would at least hold his own. I still think he’s a good player but maybe he’s miscast as a major league shortstop.

Hinske was awful this season and he came to the plate 147 times. Hinske was the first name that came to mind when you guys mentioned LVP. But it’s good that he was just a bench player.

Things we would change: How about Simmons getting the call-up on Opening Day instead of Pastornicky? In hindsight, perhaps that could have made a noticeable difference. I have to stress the hindsight part because, again, I thought Pastornicky would at least hold his own as a major league shortstop.
11
Leah Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 1:18 pm
Hinske! Almost forgot he was on the team.
12
Steve Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 2:19 pm
@10 – I really considered the Simmons’ call up as my do over. But I decided that he needed the extra seasoning he got those couple of months and that’s why he was so successful. It seems kinda silly seeing it in print, but that was the thought process/dismissal process I went through.
13
Curt Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 7:04 pm
I thought about Hinske, but that’s like blaming Homer the Brave or the grounds grew. The Paint Brush. He was a complete nothing. Granted, those 147 ABs were almost completely wasted, but I don’t remember him costing us too many games.

Feel free to now insert a list of all of the games he cost us.
14
Curt Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 7:05 pm
Or all the games the Paint Brush won for us
15
Leah Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 7:59 pm
I hope Hanson lays off the doughnuts in the off season. He’s gotten a bit thick around the middle.
16
Bubdylan Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 8:41 pm
I’m going out on the longest, loneliest limb of all time and predicting that #10, Jones, plays at least one more game for the Atlanta Braves.
17
Curt Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 10:18 pm
One of his sons?
18
Bubdylan Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 10:32 pm
No, Chipper himself. Wasn’t trying to be opaque, just like calling him Jones.
19
Steve Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 11:13 pm
@16 – Bub, what in the hell are you talking about?
20
Bubdylan Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 11:15 pm
lol, I think Chipper will come out of retirement.
21
Bubdylan Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 11:17 pm
No matter how this turns out, Leyland’s an idiot.
22
Bubdylan Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 11:21 pm
nevermind, he was just leaving him in for one batter after the homer.
23
Bubdylan Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 11:25 pm
Strike one to Tex. Get ‘im, Coke.
24
Bubdylan Says:
October 16th, 2012 at 11:29 pm
Erg. Tex singles.
Get Cano.

(Rooting against the Yankees is reasonably fun)
25
Bubdylan Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 12:04 am
Bye Bye Yanks…
Bye Bye crappiness…
Hellooo De… troit … ness? Um. G’night.
26
will Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 5:28 am
@ 20 he’ll have to return his surfboard
27
Curt Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 6:29 am
I really wish ARoid was still in the lineup to add to his epically bad postseason career. Wonder if the Yanks would ever try and get rid of him? Wonder if they could?
28
Steve Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 7:53 am
@27 – With as big a name as Arod is, if the Yankees covered enough salary, they could absolutely move him.
29
Bubdylan Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 10:41 am
It’s true that Chipper’s goodbye tour would be diminished if he came back for a season, or half a season, but what about for two weeks in September?

Just sayin’: you heard it here first.
30
Steve Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 10:52 am
@29- what I’m saying is that’s crazy talk.
31
will Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 11:05 am
@29 i like it, but only if he plays in Elvis suitpants
32
Bubdylan Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 11:27 am
Steve, if it wasn’t crazy talk, would I even be saying it?
33
Mark in Memphis Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 12:10 pm
Put me in the “pious and arrogance” category… I don’t think it is ever justified to throw thing on the field.

I was happy to see Atlanta fans turn out, be vocal, show exitement and cheer on the team; however, “Adult” means you control you outbursts and limit them to acceptable behavior.

Would you still be approving this if instead of throwing objects at the umpire 15 or 20 people stormed the field and beat him up?

Like it or not, argree with it or not, this is a step towards the type of “mob mentality” behavior that you hear of where soccer officials are killed after games…
34
Bubdylan Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 1:02 pm
@31, I’d buy tickets for that.
35
Leah Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 1:09 pm
@33. MinM there was so much tension in that crowd in that moment I wondered if that wasn’t going to happen. That would have been over the top. If it were a normal type of blown call or the Braves were in the lead or it wasn’t the stupid 1 game playoff I would agree with you.
36
Bubdylan Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 1:46 pm
Also, soccer fans have an excuse to be violent: they’ve just paid money to watch … soccer.
37
Bubdylan Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 1:51 pm
In all seriousness, I’m with Mark. I’m repulsed by fans throwing stuff. But on the other hand, I would have done it if I’d have had a beer can and a good shot at the field. I’d have regretted it later, and felt scuzzy, but I’d have done it for sure. Them’s just facts.
38
Mark in Memphis Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 3:07 pm
@36

So funny!
39
Steve Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 3:09 pm
@33 – MinM. I totally get it. And I can’t really, in good conscience, defend the actions of the fans that night (as good and right as it all felt in the moment). That said, comparing the garbage throwing to storming the field and beating up the umps makes no sense.
40
Leah Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 3:27 pm
“St. Louis fans are really into baseball. I enjoy playing in games when fans get into it because that’s what baseball is.” – Gregor Blanco

Is that a dig?
41
Mark in Memphis Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 3:34 pm
I think Bourn is gone.

Boras + career year in leadoff categories + showing more power + well above average defender = BIG payday ($80M for 6 years-ish).

Atlanta should not write that contract – it would hamstring us to sign Freeman, Heyward, etc. in the future. Plus Bourn is 30 and folks of his skills can fall off quickly beyond that age.

I am somewhat with Curt (that hurt a little to say ) in that it is likely to be Angel Pagan. He has speed, good OBP, some power and is above average in the field. And at 4.85M last year, he probably won’t cost-prohibitive, he won’t cost us a “piece” and could be traded or moved to LF if Todd Cunningham starts showing he can play at ML club level.

I am somewhat w/ Steve in that I think Wren might go the trade route based on his comments about the FA class.
-The Twins have Revere (young, fast, low strikeout rate, no power) and Span (good OBP, great glove, good walk and K rate – will cost more than Revere) and need pitching (badly).
-Dexter Fowler (CO) is Atlanta native, relitively young (26), good OBP w/ high walk rate but also high K rate, 10+ hr & 10+ steals expected, decent glove but highly athletic (might get better – got to remember his defensive stats are based on playing 80 games in the expanse that is the Col outfield…) and a switch hitter. Probably will cost more than than either Revere or Span.
42
Mark in Memphis Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 3:39 pm
@39

Really… “no” sense?

You really believe the first few things thrown onto the field were not things aimed at hurting that umpire?

Everything that followed was just “joining in” mentality, but the first few where trying to hit the umpire…

Not a real “leap” in my mind between throw a bottle at the umpire and throwing a fist at the umpire… the first is just a bit more cowardly as you probably won’t get caught…
43
Bubdylan Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 3:41 pm
Steve, I don’t think mentioning it as a “a step towards” a “mentality where you hear of…” is quite the same as comparing in the sense that you must mean.

Maybe you don’t agree it’s even a step in that direction? I honestly don’t know. There are a ton of scholarly articles on “football hooliganism” that I’ve skimmed for psych class, etc, but I don’t remember any of them ever mentioning a history of non-violent vandalism as a harbinger of the rough stuff. Most chronicles of it start with “the first fistfight in ______ was recorded in 1535 during a blah blah.”

Anyway, just spitballing here, but I don’t think that it’s too much of a stretch to call throwing crap on the field a riotous act, mob rule, etc. In any case, M in M’s statement makes sense, whether it’s tenable or not.

/feels the impulse to edit this and take out big words to avoid looking pedantic
//is too lazy
/// submits comment and runs away
44
Steve Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 4:36 pm
@42 – Maybe I’m being naive but no, I don’t think the intent of the initial bottle throws was to hit or to hurt the umps. More just a loud, disruptive, obnoxious, misdemeanor-ous, expression of frustation.

And yes, while cowardly, that’s part of why these things are not comparable. No one went out on to the field, nor did I see anyone attempt to. You go onto the field in a situation like that, you are intending to do harm. I get it. This did not feel like that kind of a dangerous situation.

I get that it’s not a good thing. And shouldn’t happen at sporting events and it’s a gateway drug to Euro style hooliganism. But this kind of thing NEVER happens in Atlanta. EVER. And that’s part of why, taken in the vacuum I believe it lives, that it was not that big a deal.
45
Walker Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 6:09 pm
I know I will get killed on here, but I actually like Alex Rodriguez. It’s crazy they are benching him like this. Sure he is struggling but the Yanks definitely won’t win the World series with Eric Chavez. Id rather take my chance with A Rod’s upside. He’s still one of the top 25 players who ever played, steroids or no steroids.
46
Leah Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 7:09 pm
@44 Hear hear

@45 What is happening to our youth!
47
Bub Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 7:28 pm
Guys, I’m not seeing the little asterisk that denotes a pick-up option on Angel Pagan’s free agency. Did I mishear the podcast? Wasn’t that the reason he was kind of being ruled out by us?
48
Bub Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 7:30 pm
http://www.baseballprospectus.com/compensation/cots/?page_id=177

That’s what I’m going by. I looked it up because DOB was all about some A. Pagan in his latest who-to-get article the other day.
49
Ham Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 10:08 pm
Bub, I thought SF had an option on Pagan. Again, facts shmacts.
50
Bub Says:
October 17th, 2012 at 11:14 pm
Well, if he’s available, let’s get him. I’m a big fan of Angel from what little I’ve seen in interviews, etc. Seems like a real pro and a good clubhouse guy. I could get fairly excited if the Braves targeted Pagan.
51
Leah Says:
October 18th, 2012 at 6:44 am
I’d love him to prices if he’d homer every time a Cardinals’ pitcher threw the ball at him.
52
WatchingBraves Says:
October 18th, 2012 at 2:02 pm
Thanks guys. I’ve started listening regularly this year and love it.

My do-over would be sending down Medlen to be stretched out. If I remember correctly we lost at least two games that the bullpen blew during that time and then we put him back in the bullpen. When we put him back in the rotation he didn’t need to stretch out. Complete waste.
53
Leah Says:
October 18th, 2012 at 3:51 pm
@42 Not to split hairs but we were sitting perpendicular to the infield fly ball hit in the outfield two feet behind a flailing Pete Kozma. The first two items I saw thrown were foul of 3rd base. Just sayin…no where close to any umpire. If MLB doesn’t want a dangerous situation they shouldn’t hire bone headed umpires.
So not over it…
54
Bub Says:
October 18th, 2012 at 3:56 pm
“If MLB doesn’t want a dangerous situation they shouldn’t hire bone headed umpires.”

What a disgusting sentiment, Princess. It’s a sport.
55
Shaun Says:
October 18th, 2012 at 5:54 pm
Walker @45, I don’t really have any strong personal feelings about A-Rod, either way. I do think all the attention he’s getting is pretty ridiculous.

He’s 37, has a bad hip and who knows what else?

How about some blame on the Yankees’ front office for relying on aging, worn-down players to get them to the Series, if you want to place blame and draw attention somewhere?
56
Walker Says:
October 18th, 2012 at 9:03 pm
I say kudos to A- Rod for leveraging monster 2007 season into that huge contract. The Yankees made the mistake of giving him way too many years instead of shortening the length of the contract and just upping his AAV or Annual Average Value. Id rather overpay and aging player over 4-5 years instead of giving him 7-9 years just to lower his AAV.

Also, he may be overpaid but he was a 2 win player according to WAR which is good. He still gets on base.

But he is fairly criticized as a horrible postseason performer.
57
Leah Says:
October 18th, 2012 at 9:49 pm
@54 There’s the rub…doesn’t feel like a sport. Wish it did.
58
Leah Says:
October 18th, 2012 at 9:50 pm
…and my hatred for the Cardinals is growing.
59
Leah Says:
October 18th, 2012 at 9:51 pm
…also, rally towels…way cooler than foam tomahawks.
60
Curt Says:
October 18th, 2012 at 9:58 pm
Winning in the postseason…way cooler than losing
61
Leah Says:
October 18th, 2012 at 10:13 pm
@60 soooooo true.
62
Steve Says:
October 19th, 2012 at 11:14 am
@52 – WatchinbBraves. Welcome. Are you the WatchingBraves twitter account?

@59 – that is a great point. I realize it will never change, but I’m so tired of the foam tomahawks. It’s a disappointment every time it’s the giveaway.
63
WatchingBraves Says:
October 19th, 2012 at 1:19 pm
@62 Thanks Steve. Yes that is me.
64
Mark in Memphis Says:
October 19th, 2012 at 1:22 pm
@62

Create a towel with a cool name related to the Atlanta Braves.
Set all proceeds to go to an Atlanta charity/school.
Get permission from MLB and the Braves where necessary.
Start producing and selling them…
Maybe it will catch on and put a dent in the foam tomahawks…
65
Steve Says:
October 19th, 2012 at 1:33 pm
@64 – I like it.

So, this whole thing is pretty funny, but check out #20 which is very funny with a bonus Jason Heyward appearance. http://www.buzzfeed.com/daves4/21-situations-you-should-be-happy-youre-not-in
66
Bub Says:
October 19th, 2012 at 2:03 pm
#65, some hitters scare pitchers so bad they poop themselves, but only Jason Heyward can make you poop a spiderman.
67
Leah Says:
October 19th, 2012 at 9:28 pm
Wahooooo! I mean, Cards are still gonna win but it was a fun 4th.
68
Leah Says:
October 19th, 2012 at 9:28 pm
Top of the 4th.
69
Kate Says:
October 19th, 2012 at 10:56 pm
Cardinals giving away runs by making errors and getting shut down by Barry Zito. Did they switch places with the Braves?
70
Steve Says:
October 21st, 2012 at 1:06 am
Was at a coffee shop in Atlantic Station today (big midtown Atlanta shopping area) and in walks Freddie Freeman and girl friend. I got totally star struck and successfully fought the urge to go talk to him.
71
Leah Says:
October 21st, 2012 at 11:16 am
@70 So cool! I would have asked for a pic with him. You’re so much cooler than I.
72
Steve Says:
October 21st, 2012 at 10:37 pm
@71 – I really wanted to talk to him and congratulate him on his season, etc, but he immediately sat at the bar/counter with his girlfriend and that felt too intrusive somehow. If was just at a table or a couch or something like that, I would have absolutely spoken to him.
73
Leah Says:
October 22nd, 2012 at 3:21 pm
Let’s go Giants!
74
Leah Says:
October 22nd, 2012 at 8:20 pm
Poor on the pain Pagan!
75
Bub Says:
October 22nd, 2012 at 9:17 pm
@St. L.

Laugh.
Out.
Loud.
76
Steve Says:
October 22nd, 2012 at 9:42 pm
Just finished recording a show with DOB and I’m seeing the score for the first time. Wow. Go GIANTS!

Show #205: The Braves 2012 Season Wrap Up

76 Responses to “Show #205: The Braves 2012 Season Wrap Up”

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